poetry critical

online poetry workshop



loves leaky language, ars poetica ♥
AlchemiA

metaPoetry

.

.


it'd be indefinable and unknown,
 1
especially unknown! and these unknowns,
 2
they'd complete us...
 3
 
 
it'd start with a cosmic sentiment;
 4
a serendipity that's bent
 5
toward this infinite-in,
 6
where love in a radiant bouquet
 7
bursts to blossom as you,
 8
over and over again --
 9
 
 
there, where a music in you is
 10
eager to sing in a mellifluous-voice
 11
which only the heart can hear,
 12
and it'd take you into a melodious rhythm 'n roll,
 13
a riff 'round the sound of a whirl'd
 14
swelling with a kiss of bliss;
 15
'tis this that'd speak in that uncommon tongue,
 16
the Poetic one --
 17
 
 
it'd risk absurdity in an u n f e t t e r e d language,
 18
and with an unbounded-eye,
 19
(not limited to the fatal-skin yer' in,)
 20
it'd look and look and dare to see,
 21
the beauty of this conflicted sentimental-reality;
 22
this creative-destruction outpouring
 23
into the middle of things,
 24
where good Homer nods,
 25
where loves-leaky-language goes,
 26
there, into a potpourri that is the Art-of-Poetry...
 27

19 Feb 14

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I will always bow to musicality of the tongue
bow
 — looniverse

metaPoetry = poetry which is self referencing itself as poetry, and contains self-referential material to poetry.

i do like this as a read, but i'm not sure it entirely captures a full picture, either of itself or it's meta self.

the unknowns that we don't yet know .. isn't really explored, which this has a lot of potential to do.

there's music here, spoken of and incorporated, but i'm hearing themes but not the bridges between the themes.

still, a good read, but with some of the score still to compose :)
 — jenn

meta poetry is pure sound, not thought... it's no longer sentential and has no self-reference that anyone with an IQ under 150 might understand as melody. it's called 'music', but not the kind that's used to sell music.

but, this little piece isn't even musical, much less music. it's more like reactions engineered into strings of narcissa... "me and me, and you can love me too"

i don't expect anyone here to understand poetry, but calling this non-poetry because it doesn't work in candid mode is pretty campy... black feathers and red lipstick waiting to be photographed: 'genius for rent! me! me!'
 — cadmium

"i don't expect anyone here to understand poetry"

You have nothing to teach about 'what is poetry', Mike.
 — jenn

"meta poetry is pure sound"

No it's not.
 — jenn

Back to your usual trolling, Mike?
 — jenn

I've always appreciated the sound of words before the meaning, and that was what struck me here. There is a joy in it, a revelry. It may be narcissistic, yes, but all writing has a "look at me" aspect, even if it is only to be looked at by its author.

I think a writer should write to please himself, first and foremost. Not sure what the IQ comment has to do about anything, though. Good to know those with the biggest quotient get to be so small minded.


ha
 — looniverse

it depends on whether the author is seeking someone or writing about himself seeking someone. that's where the music differs. the personals ad is a march, a careful manipulation of button-pushing, depending on performance and intonation. the creation of a world, however, follows its emotion, making a natural music... a creation of phrasing, not of sentences. this piece is just too talky, and that's not poetry, that's gossip.
 — cadmium

thanky0u for the reads -- this is by no means modern and rather talks a lot with musicality rolling through it like a river undulating the words -- obvious strokes with a 'lil orchestration, not to mention some pedantic mentation -- nonetheless, I like it for the song and the singer get's to play with the words that tumble off the tongue in a mellifluous way -- so, you're all write in your various critiques, in all of your considered views, in the way each of you like to speak, nevertheless it's unbounded by any differences, between me and you, between the shadow and the soul, where love is want to grow ...
 — AlchemiA

Sartre averred: "follow the pen without looking for words." - homo-luminous turn'd an innuendo-invertendo into a whirl'd rolling ʞɔɐq-words for some more, where deep calls to deep, where it'd risk absurdity in an u n f e t t e r e d language, where the beginning of you is the end of me ...
 — AlchemiA

for me - poetic-individuation is the way being under-understood where you're feeling overwhelmed by the cloud-of-unknowing, by the deep calling to deep, where mystery is our work, in the tears that we weep, in the dreams of our sleep ... There’s something wonderful in the cloud-of-unknowing that imagist Poetry tries to present. It’s the unfinished, undone qualities of potential that make the infinity of possibility trivial. To my mind, these Poets of concision and image seem to enjoy the process of their craft and the unfinished story they produce. Unfinished because it's the reader who completes the story with their own gathering reflections. I’d imagine ‘knowing’ to be the end of ‘curiosity’ and all of its earnest joyful speculation.
 — AlchemiA

I think I understand you as a writer a bit more now, Alch.

The fluid freedom of the word and sound scape you create is both elusive and immediate.. as any surreal scape should be, but also draws the viewer, listener, reader into something sub-known even if it remains unnamed and unknown.

I like to re-read your poems after you've commented on them as it unknots some of what I find to be a bit of a tangle, though never unreadable, just circumventionally curved into shapes I know and don't know. :)
 — jenn

alc, do you write listening to music on the pod, or do you write so that the words invent the music? because, if all you're doing is copying phrases you thought were kind of poetic and putting them into sentences, thinking they have to be poetic sentences because the phrases were so poetic? Because, what you end up with here is a collection of cliches stitched together in an arty way. it's the worst way to write, because it doesn't have the intelligence of a story, nor the consciousness of a genuinely created from only your heart poem. If all you want to do is tell some babe's you've got a vacancy in your heart, then that's fine, but that's a personal's ad not a poem. Anyone with a strong poetic sensibility is going to try to read this as a poem and only see this greedy man cloning others' thoughts and phrases... phrases like, 'love's leaking language', which is mine, of course, and originally was an ironic put-down of my own attempts to seduce with poetry -- thing i used to do when i was a stupid boy.
 — cadmium

thanks jenn -- “For you know that I myself am a labyrinth, where one easily gets lost.” ― Charles Perrault
 — AlchemiA

loves-leaky-language is yours and I used it here because originally this was an answer to one of your poetic-diatribes and dissertations -- it is simply an answer to the question you posed about poetic-melodies where the language is simple and musik is sound
 — AlchemiA

remember when it was all about inventing an alchemical poetry, one beyond getting 10's -- a kind of shamanic act, where the writing was meant to be so simple and conscious and effective as an invention of emotion that you'd turn the reader into a poet, not an admirer?
 — cadmium

yes I do and thank-you for remembering my goal and this piece is not there -- the Alchemy of Awe, that sweetest sap, that runs from roots within my chest, and seeps to branch and leaves of Wonder, to where it is that I still ponder ...

Often the story-teller or Poet is like a magician doing a magic show -- she does her second best trick first, befuddles us with some not-bad moves 'til the end where she marvels us with her best-trick of pulling the rabbit out of the hat -- however, some poets scintillate their sounds with frequencies that whorls in your inner-ear where they divine as music in the brain to create a world of synergy, pattern-recognition, all over again -- yes, and by this alchemy-of-word, the brain detects changes that become signals which glow sympathetically as warmth in the chest, or a chill to the bone, rising again as a whispered sigh or deep gutteral moan -- so the magic is really that we're all connected to sounds that become music in our head, words that resonate with images and memories of smell and sight, thus making a frisson to glissando up the spine, as oh and awe, and that's a Poetry so fine...
 — AlchemiA

a rougish holy transmutation
to become whom I ought to be;
an evolutionary transubstatiation,
another light in dark infinity
 — AlchemiA

What I see is Alch writing alchemy and Mike only talking about it, as he can only do.

I think I know who prefer as a guide into and through this rabbit hole.
 — jenn

who I *
 — jenn

jenn, what you see is of no importance to critique. alc may patronize you so that you don't spam him with your fake unk's and mor posts, but that's alc -- getting the hugs that senior citizens miss out on by hanging out at the senior center.
 — cadmium

Mike, what you see is of no importance to anything. End of story.
 — jenn

Mike, we know you have been trolling as an Unk and spamming poems with advert spam, so please don't try to pose as the pure spiritual guru you imagine yourself to be in your rather petty little mind :)
 — jenn

Alch at least has a body of work which reflects a true vision of his self-art.
you have nothing but a hole in your face called a mouth, Mike, and it does very little.

I don't know what I find more offensive, you using the word 'shaman' as though you could ever know what a shaman really is, or you coming back here to peddle your worthless recipe for 'what is poetry'.

As always, you're all talk, Mike, and no walk.
 — jenn

why would i need to say anonymous ugly things, when you do that so well for us all?
 — cadmium

You need to as much as you need to come back here to practice your oh-so superior-than-thou snobbery.
 — jenn

i'm actually more interested in having a dialog with alc, not playing mind-games with your type. sadism is so '80's, jenn, and so is the 'poetry' and 'critique' you borrow from others and post as your own.

alc, on line 18, what's the point of 'an' in this phrase? to make it a real sentence and not just some emo you, as an engineer, would be embarrassed to write? you can just say, 'unfettered talk, with unbounded eyes...' -- that would make this direct and from you, rather than sounding like a law-clerk's typing practice. Who is this written for? is it just blogging-out as a mating call?
 — cadmium

the only thing you're interested in, Mike, is stroking your ego.
you have nothing else to offer.
 — jenn

as for 'borrowing' from others you are a master of theft and plagiarism, aren't you Mike.

i'd call you a half-baked wannabe TS Eliot, but that would still be deeply offensive to Eliot.
 — jenn

there's no one single idea about art or writing that you haven't thieved wholesale and posted on here as your 'original' thoughts.
even your wittering about phenomenology is a stolen idea but one you presented here as original.
they say a good artist copies but a great artist steals .. neither applies to you though.
 — jenn

'unfettered talk, with unbounded eyes...'  is quite an awful construction of both language and sound. entirely unsuited to this poem.
perhaps it seems good to a 12 year old who has started writing as they consider their own first experiences of self-reflection, but it's childish writing whichever way you look at it.
 — jenn

Mermaids sing smooth scales, lulling the melodious sea, rolling-it-around with the sound, until it becomes a p e a r l -- and that pearl is the soul, awash in a whirl'd of flow and friction, 'til from true grit it shines, reflecting everything, all a-round, the sea, the sky, your inner outward looking eye, holding the light it has found...

the goal of soul is an ancient ache, the incessant longing to be infinitely-in, to linger on the edge of silence, to swell in waves of ardor and wash upon a further shore, to go where love beckons us, to follow our hearts much more...

"Constant, abrasive irritation produces the pearl: it is a disease of the oyster." -- Lenny Bruce
 — AlchemiA

jenn, if you really knew poetry you'd know that this alc thing is too much like Eliot and not enough like my poetry. Like Eliot, it's just a collection of odd sentences.

Now, Alc's deal is that when we're all drunk and mellow together the world's a better place. Yours seems to involve making people give you compliments... and, mine is about finding another consciousness that actually cares enough to help someone find the path out of self-victim.

Alc and I have had this discussion for years -- he knows exactly what he's doing, even if he sometimes has to sound like the village idiot to herd you cats into purr-ful purpose. Unfortunately for him, I'm here too and I see the site as the one place where we can talk about the creativity of poetry writing, and not just pet each other for being so superior and sensitive. Anyone can talk Martha Stewart talk, and certainly Alc is decorating the site with Ikea easy-to-understand metaphysics.

Oh, happy day when jerry garcia washed his sins away.
 — cadmium

Mike, I didn't read anything past the first 3 words you typed.

You're a wannabe TS Eliot and your poetry is hack work, at best.

Go back to your 'cubist' non-space and contemplate non-entity.
 — jenn

My honest and most profoundly kind advice I can give you, Mike, is for you to fuck off.

From my heart.
 — jenn

you cad -- 'This' veers into a narrow gyre, rolling 'round the moment into more, there where you and I are, surrounded by what life is going for...
 — AlchemiA

I'd hate you to think I am not in favour of developing consciousness into new creative patterns and directions, Alch.

.. and forgive me for filling your space here with trash, but you know how I feel about the arrogant snot-rag Mike trying to lord it over others when he is such a turd of a human being.
 — jenn

I can't tell you how many arrogant, jaw-flapping, bone-dry dead mouthed self obsessed 'literary men' I'd had to sit with through long dull hours listening to them tell me how they've got it all figured out, how they know art and spiritual consciousness and if I only listen to them close enough I'll get it too.

There are very few true Alchemists of knowing and doing, but many ... many dead end, self conversationalists who go nowhere and do nothing and because they can use language degrade others with it, to bring them down to their own empty, hollow nothingness.

Again, I think I'd know, out of the two of you, who would bore the living crap out of me were we ever to be able to sit and talk for a while.
 — jenn

by-all-means, jenn,, now and then, this-way or that, you've been earnest, robust and curiousor-and-curiousor -- someone like you makes many reflections that're rapturous and arise from a Goddess too ...
 — AlchemiA

'This' veers into a narrow gyre, rolling 'round the moment into more, there where you and I are, surrounded by what life is fuKing for...
 — AlchemiA

NO, I did make a personal condition not to do this sort of thing again on pC, regardless of the provocation, so forgive and I'll just read your conversations, as I enjoy the beautifully flexible way you use and create the language.

Some may see it as 'easy-to-understand metaphysics', but I see it as beautifully flexible linguistic gymnastics :)
 — jenn

cad --> https://www. youtube.com/watch?v=uT3SBzmDxGk -- 2CELLOS - Thunderstruck -- testosterone shots for you and yours, your ballz that-is

testosterone shots

'This' veers into a narrow gyre, rolling 'round the moment into more, there where you and I are, insinuated by what life is fuKing for... a murmur, an in-your-face ɹoɹɹıɯ:mirror, a murmuration of invertendo-innuendos, making a whirl'd of emotion, and in the musical notion, that we're on the wings of flying hither-and-thither than ever we were before ...
 — AlchemiA

2CELLOS are awesome! Musicians that can tell you to go fuck yourself and make you go wow! with excellent music :)

Classical Cello punk rockers!

The cello is my favourite stringed instrument. I knew a girl, a long time ago, a cello player, half French half Japanese, and she played in a stringed quartet, often doing street performances in and around Paris or Berlin, sometimes London. She played a full size cello, whilst another girl in the quartet played a 3/4 one.
Omg they were good.
 — jenn

happenstance-Art or the serendipity of space at this time and place ...
 — AlchemiA

it's the overtures which are under-understood, in those resonant chambers of wood, come-hither and a call-to-arms, in meme's that're in a symapthetic-response, our heat rising like that, along the frisson of a falling-curve ...
 — AlchemiA

yesTosterone wood-horses
 — AlchemiA

auroras -- do you whistle at them, it seems to draw them nearer to you

http://globalnews.ca/news/1177910/look- up-chance-of-northern-lights-across-canada/
 — AlchemiA

jenn, you know that you read me to build your vocabulary and style. if you're so hip, so always aware and on the edge, why are you so square about poetry? my stuff isn't cubism at all -- it's a lyric poetry from the poetic tradition. your stuff is moving away from balken epic and lyric and into quirky. Where did you learn to say 'cubism'? -- i think you know better but think that it's a button you can push. maybe it works, but it's pretty passive-agressive.

you're no help here for poetry, just 'personality, and poets are their personality in their poems.
 — cadmium

alc, 'serendipity' needs a duality, but you're cramming it into monotony. you don't write poetry in happenstance -- that's called 'fooling around with words', and you're not a good enough humorist to make it interesting...fukker-- using 'homer' as though you were at a cocktail party.
 — cadmium

I don't believe in chance, or coincidence or even serendipity, and I certainly don't believe in fate or destiny.

It's just those exceptional moments when you see / think / understand / know / are conscious of what it is .. what it actually is ..

... and we would need a thousand billion compound eyes made up of millions and billions of other eyes seeing every frequency and wave and spectrum, and a brain that what firing on a full 100% of it's true crystalline potential to see, for real, actually see ..

There is no change or coincidence or serendipity ... just us seeing the joins in the scenery, the mechanisms that make the clouds float by, the lime-lights that burn at the heart of every star ... and the stage manager, fleetingly prompts us when we forget what our next line is ... and we see it and KNOW it but tell ourselves it was just coincidence because when we try to remember that we already know all of this anyway ... it's too big a memory for us to process.
Way too big.
We see the little bits of art and music, and then we slip contentedly back into our coma.

When I get a shiver from a moment of deja vu or serendipitous re-joining of back-drop scenery I know that's my true self shivering, knowing.
 — jenn

feeling stressed is a desperate reflex which you do to feel separate, recalcitrant and reactive, where there's a strange klik-klac, way back, in your sacroiliac ...
 — AlchemiA

"alc, 'serendipity' needs a duality"


Incorrect. Serendipity needs (is) a singularity.
Serendipity is disparate (many) parts becoming whole again.
 — jenn

that what  = that is *
 — jenn

"you don't write poetry in happenstance"


Actually, you can write poetry in any stance. Happen or not.

There is no fixed 'rule' to poetry. Just made up ones.
 — jenn

"jenn, you know"


Every thing you write after this wasn't read, and completely ignored.
 — jenn

wrote *
 — jenn

urgh, my typos get so bad this late at night :)
 — jenn

yesTosterone shots

it's the overtures which are under-understood, in those resonant chambers throbbing of wood; whether come-hither or a call-to-arms, they're in meme's that're in a sympathetic-response to our heat rising like that, along the frisson of a falling-curve ...
 — AlchemiA

All information is a meme. ;

The above is also a meme...
 — jenn

take 'this' as a whatta-you-mean meme ... the mobious writer sees meme's 'n murmurs 'n twitters 'n tweets everywhere and like the mathematician is absorbed into this fractured nowness: a sort of ZeitGeist flows through their pen into words that sputter, then fire again --  the Germans also call'd it a 'Fingerspitzengefuhl' which is a sort of sixth sense for sizing up a situation -- the Poet translates a word wonder into an exhibit of the Poet's own angels&demons, their Tuum-est in it, while the Poetry itself becomes a model of the Poets own path-dependence and his own 'special-ness' in the way that words 'fuk' him, the way that he sees from that age old game of soul-search 'n spiel with language in-yer-end-oh -- a spring-ness infuses his words like the buds of May -- on our curious circuits toward Love we shall speak in many tongues, licking the edge of a hush with a blush, or the far-cry of a longing sigh -- the May dance with mirth and the juicyness of being alive - Venus springs round in passions pen, in-words now arrive'd, and now gone again ...
 — AlchemiA

I like the way you explain things, alch :)


I wish I could get you the transcript of a short play called 'Kokomo' ... a very interesting short play on the nature of information and memes.

The play could have been 4 hours long really, it was only about 25 minutes long, but they provided just enough information for it to work.
 — jenn

language arose out of the need to woo from awe into a surprising wonder, moon-moon jammed into the vibration, infused with a red-ocher thunder ...
 — AlchemiA

Yep, and art grew in us at the same time.
 — jenn

yet love is nothing if it's not care-free, even so, Fukishima lingers fateful fatal churning and turning inner fires burning on our shores...
 — AlchemiA

a mis-fortune cookie
the fiercest freedom ever over-come, over-flowed from the skin your in, is the freedom from freedom, where all things, come 'n gone, begin

she writes her insights with a lyrical pen that babbles like a brook of words that meander down the page while unfettered, glistening fish jump from line to line seeking the source of their urgent drive home -- and I'm a fisher-of-meaning patiently trolling, rolling and whipping the lines in a flash of an eye, how does a fish even cry? -- the concept of 'turn' 'n 'returns' as in circadian rhythms 'n habit patterns 'n labyrinthine passages like frontal lobes curling in the brain where you end up returning to where you started again -- fishing for pleasure 'n fishing for leisure, in a babbling brook where we're fishing for just-in-time meme'rs

mis-direction is the bate 'n switch here as an aphorism for ADD, not being queer -- the wit makes it clear that irony is best served alphabetically, within genre -- what if you made this into an acrostic, now that'd be fun, words unfettered 'n undone

a fortunate cookie

if brevity is the soul of wit then levity is the goal of it, and may the soul your with be brief 'n to this ancient ache with which we woo each other, sister and brother, where our care-free play in a moan of murmurs, in an undertow wave of sweet eternity, in every particle you take, in the empty space, where brevity is out of place --
 — AlchemiA

A feeling -
weaker than a comma -
stronger than a period.
 — AlchemiA

'I like puzzles," she said with a quixotic stare. and I let her in, just there
 — AlchemiA

i miss alc. nobody really verbal here anymore.
 — cadmium

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